12 thoughts on “Does the American dream still count???”
DEFINE YOUR DREAM
Tell me what the American Dream is, then Ill tell you if it counts.
money
money and everything money can bring–which is a lot. yet, i feel a great loss around all the material gain.
Given the current political and economic climate
Given the current state of affairs, I might wonder myself. Personally, I’ve always felt ambivalent about the American dream and how we as a people are a part of it.
Does the American dream still count? I would ask compared to what? The war mongering is repugnant, declining values and loss of civil society make the American dream more a nightmare.
COLLECTIVE DREAM
There is no American Dream. There never was.
The Dreams of the Human Species is collective — a collective consciousness. Realizing this collective dream is what the human rights movement is all about. It not called American Rights, or whatever rights; it is called Human Rights.
Lets try to steer toward a Universal Dream, not back to a local, provincial dream. Hunger, disease, birth, genocide, death…these are human conditions, not American, Puerto Rican, Cuban, French…
The solutions to these human conditions are universal or nothing. We all realize the dream or none of us do.
RE: COLLECTIVE DREAM — Yes, but…
Here, here! It always grates me to hear the term “American Dream.” You must admit, however, that the dream may be “collective” but the way to realize it is cultural, social, individual, economic. And that’s what makes the difference.
RE: RE: COLLECTIVE DREAM — Yes, but…
Even in its ‘local’ realization, the human dream looks the same all over. For example, take a typical street scene tha we might consider to be quintessencially Puerto Rican: small groups of men playing dominoes. Well, have you ever noticed that half the world plays dominoes, and I dont mean the Spanish-speaking world. Cuisines vary, but does that affect the way we thing about things. Are Italians the best designers because they eat so much pasta.
My point is this, people around the world have appearances that may be unique to their regions or groups, and dress differently, but I fail to see the difference values (you would have to agree that our dreams express our values).
I love being latino, but my values on what constitutes quality of life do not differ in any way from someone on the other side of the plan.
Probe a little more
We can differ even in conception of what a dream is. I think Americans, including myself, see dreams as goals that drive us. And although one can argue that Freud, and therefore, Europeans too, see dreams as functioning similarly, our conception tends to be more utilitarian while theirs remains more interpretive — i f you will, diagnostic.
Specifically, “American Dream” it refers to getting a “piece of the American pie,” that is, some amount of material wealth and standing. I think today people like the idea of “Livin’ Large” which is basically another way of saying the same thing. We have a certain lust for things and what we mean by American Dream quite simply is moving uptown.
RE: RE: RE: COLLECTIVE DREAM — Yes, but…
I like very much what you said. But I was also hoping that you would help me out with some thoughts.
The importance of integrating the Spanish culture into the American Education System or the American Culture.
As for, What are your gender roles in the Spanish Culture?
What does family structure really mean to the Spanish Culture?
What Educational Values do you think would benefit from this?
What types of Discipline Traditions are in the Spanish culture?
Why do you feel your Culture should be integrated in the American School System?
I am doing a paper for College and would like the spanish people views.
Problem you’re having
You must distinguish which “Spanish culture” you are exploring. You must do much more research my friend. The only Spanish culture to speak of would have to be in Spain. If you are speaking of the Latino cultures of the United States, then you need to make a lot of distinctions between old and new immigrant cultures and where those populations originate from since they are all quite distinct. Your term “Spanish culture” is the equivalent of asking a question about “English culture”. Do you mean Australians, New Zealanders, Americans, Canadians, Englishman, etc. Do you understand what I’m saying? Who do you mean?
Puerto Rican Dream, aqui y alla
I’m interested in the Puerto Rican Dream, what does that consist of here and there?
RE: Given the current political and economic clima
The American dream? What ever happened to the Puerto Rican dream? I appreciate the efforts of this Web site and all, but my question is why are we are we (Puerto Ricans) not asking about OUR dream – the Puerto Rican dream? What is that? Does Ecuador ask about its Bolivian dream? Does the US ask about its French dream (ha, that’s probably a loaded question right about now!)?
I look at the question of “Puerto Rico and the American Dream” like Puerto Rico and the diaspora evolving within the family of the Americas—as a country and nation, with its own dream.
Diego
What is your PR dream?
Right on! I’m more interested in our own dream. What is your dream, brother?
DEFINE YOUR DREAM
Tell me what the American Dream is, then Ill tell you if it counts.
money
money and everything money can bring–which is a lot. yet, i feel a great loss around all the material gain.
Given the current political and economic climate
Given the current state of affairs, I might wonder myself. Personally, I’ve always felt ambivalent about the American dream and how we as a people are a part of it.
Does the American dream still count? I would ask compared to what? The war mongering is repugnant, declining values and loss of civil society make the American dream more a nightmare.
COLLECTIVE DREAM
There is no American Dream. There never was.
The Dreams of the Human Species is collective — a collective consciousness. Realizing this collective dream is what the human rights movement is all about. It not called American Rights, or whatever rights; it is called Human Rights.
Lets try to steer toward a Universal Dream, not back to a local, provincial dream. Hunger, disease, birth, genocide, death…these are human conditions, not American, Puerto Rican, Cuban, French…
The solutions to these human conditions are universal or nothing. We all realize the dream or none of us do.
RE: COLLECTIVE DREAM — Yes, but…
Here, here! It always grates me to hear the term “American Dream.” You must admit, however, that the dream may be “collective” but the way to realize it is cultural, social, individual, economic. And that’s what makes the difference.
RE: RE: COLLECTIVE DREAM — Yes, but…
Even in its ‘local’ realization, the human dream looks the same all over. For example, take a typical street scene tha we might consider to be quintessencially Puerto Rican: small groups of men playing dominoes. Well, have you ever noticed that half the world plays dominoes, and I dont mean the Spanish-speaking world. Cuisines vary, but does that affect the way we thing about things. Are Italians the best designers because they eat so much pasta.
My point is this, people around the world have appearances that may be unique to their regions or groups, and dress differently, but I fail to see the difference values (you would have to agree that our dreams express our values).
I love being latino, but my values on what constitutes quality of life do not differ in any way from someone on the other side of the plan.
Probe a little more
We can differ even in conception of what a dream is. I think Americans, including myself, see dreams as goals that drive us. And although one can argue that Freud, and therefore, Europeans too, see dreams as functioning similarly, our conception tends to be more utilitarian while theirs remains more interpretive — i f you will, diagnostic.
Specifically, “American Dream” it refers to getting a “piece of the American pie,” that is, some amount of material wealth and standing. I think today people like the idea of “Livin’ Large” which is basically another way of saying the same thing. We have a certain lust for things and what we mean by American Dream quite simply is moving uptown.
RE: RE: RE: COLLECTIVE DREAM — Yes, but…
I like very much what you said. But I was also hoping that you would help me out with some thoughts.
The importance of integrating the Spanish culture into the American Education System or the American Culture.
As for, What are your gender roles in the Spanish Culture?
What does family structure really mean to the Spanish Culture?
What Educational Values do you think would benefit from this?
What types of Discipline Traditions are in the Spanish culture?
Why do you feel your Culture should be integrated in the American School System?
I am doing a paper for College and would like the spanish people views.
Problem you’re having
You must distinguish which “Spanish culture” you are exploring. You must do much more research my friend. The only Spanish culture to speak of would have to be in Spain. If you are speaking of the Latino cultures of the United States, then you need to make a lot of distinctions between old and new immigrant cultures and where those populations originate from since they are all quite distinct. Your term “Spanish culture” is the equivalent of asking a question about “English culture”. Do you mean Australians, New Zealanders, Americans, Canadians, Englishman, etc. Do you understand what I’m saying? Who do you mean?
Puerto Rican Dream, aqui y alla
I’m interested in the Puerto Rican Dream, what does that consist of here and there?
RE: Given the current political and economic clima
The American dream? What ever happened to the Puerto Rican dream? I appreciate the efforts of this Web site and all, but my question is why are we are we (Puerto Ricans) not asking about OUR dream – the Puerto Rican dream? What is that? Does Ecuador ask about its Bolivian dream? Does the US ask about its French dream (ha, that’s probably a loaded question right about now!)?
I look at the question of “Puerto Rico and the American Dream” like Puerto Rico and the diaspora evolving within the family of the Americas—as a country and nation, with its own dream.
Diego
What is your PR dream?
Right on! I’m more interested in our own dream. What is your dream, brother?